Show Notes for "Doing the Work"with Drs. Ann Ishimaru and Decoteau Irby

Jan 15
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"Doing the Work"with Drs. Ann Ishimaru and Decoteau Irby
Season 3, Episode 1

Episode Summary

In this episode of Equity Unlocked, Dr. Muhammad Khalifa is joined by Dr. Decoteau Irby and Dr. Ann Ishimaru for a deeply reflective conversation centered on their co-edited book examining equity leadership in U.S. school systems.

The discussion explores how equity leadership has evolved over time, particularly in response to key social and political moments, including the post-Trayvon Martin era, the racial reckoning of 2020, and the current period of backlash, retrenchment, and policy resistance. Using the book’s organizing metaphor of morning, midday, and evening work, Drs. Irby and Ishimaru unpack how the conditions for equity leadership shift across system timelines and historical moments, shaping what leaders can do, what risks they face, and what strategies become necessary.

Throughout the episode, the conversation highlights the emotional, professional, and physical toll of equity leadership, particularly for women of color and minoritized leaders working within systems historically designed to exclude them. The guests emphasize the importance of coalition building, community connection, and collective leadership as essential strategies for sustaining equity work over time. Rather than offering a linear roadmap, this episode invites listeners to think more deeply about timing, context, relationships, and possibility, and to recognize that even work that feels unsuccessful in the moment may lay the foundation for future change.

Resources Related to This Episode
Summary of Topics Discussed
Historical Moments Referenced
  • Trayvon Martin and the post-2012 “awakening” period in equity leadership
  • The Obama administration’s Dear Colleague Letter on school discipline
  • The 2020 racial reckoning following the murder of George Floyd
  • The subsequent backlash period, including anti-CRT legislation and book bans

Equity Leadership Concepts and Frameworks
  • Morning, Midday, and Evening Work as a metaphor for changing conditions, affordances, and constraints of equity leadership over time
  • Equity Leadership as Cyclical, not linear, requiring different strategies at different moments
  • Precarity as a defining feature of equity leadership roles
  • Coalition Building through both relationships and organizational structures
  • Seeding Work, including inquiry, listening, and groundwork that may not show immediate impact
  • Midday Work, characterized by visibility, institutional resources, and heightened scrutiny
  • Evening Work, emphasizing networks, solidarity, and sustaining the work under constraint

Practices and Methods Referenced
  • Listening tours and relationship-building prior to formal initiatives
  • Affinity-based leadership spaces, including networks of Black women principals
  • Community-based organizing and partnerships beyond school systems
  • Informal and formal communities of practice
  • Participatory and collaborative assessment approaches
  • Balancing relational trust with documented structures and routines to sustain work over time

 Topics Discussed with Time Stamps

00:00 – Opening reflections and gratitude
Dr. Khalifa opens by honoring Dr. Irby and Dr. Ishimaru’s scholarship and influence, and asks what is sustaining them right now.

01:00 – What sustains equity leaders in this moment
 Community, joy, humor, everyday acts of resistance, and staying connected rather than isolated.

02:10 – Learning, healing, and historical memory beyond schools
 Out-of-school learning spaces, youth programs, historical remembrance, and community healing.

05:20 – Laughter, joy, and humanity as sustenance
 Finding humor, joy, and relational connection amid difficult equity leadership work.

06:05 – What drew them to equity leadership
 How equity leadership became a focus of study and how the field has shifted over time.

06:40 – The historical arc of equity leadership
 From post–Trayvon Martin awakenings to 2020 expansion and the current backlash period.

08:10 – Writing the book during political transition
 Completing the book amid changing national conditions and reframing the current moment as “night.”

09:00 – Equity leadership as practice, not just roles
 Framing equity leadership around activities, practices, and constraints within oppressive systems.

10:50 – Equity work existed long before formal roles
 Justice-oriented work by communities, families, students, and educators prior to institutional recognition.

12:20 – What equity leaders should hold steady across political shifts
 Centering students, families, and communities regardless of changing administrations.

13:30 – Responding to new threats and changing conditions
 Adapting equity leadership to emergent realities like immigration enforcement and community fear.

15:00 – Moving beyond heroism or despair
 Rejecting individual saviorism and instead building from existing community organizing and networks.

16:10 – Morning, Midday, and Evening work as a leadership metaphor
 How timing and context shape what equity leaders can do.

17:10 – Leadership as contextual and historical
 Understanding how affordances and constraints shift across time, not just geography.

19:00 – Why leadership work is cyclical, not linear
 How different strategies become necessary at different moments.

20:10 – What changes across the morning, midday, and evening phases
 From seeding and framing to policy work to networks and solidarity.

22:15 – Deep dive into “morning work”
 Laying foundations through inquiry, assessment, and sensemaking.

23:40 – Seeding work that feels invisible but matters
 Why early equity work often feels unsuccessful but enables future progress.

25:10 – Tensions across the book’s chapters
 Harm, turnover, and the personal cost of equity leadership.

26:00 – The toll of equity leadership roles
 Emotional, physical, and professional harm, especially for women of color.

27:10 – Why some stories could not be told
 IRB limits, district resistance, and the real danger faced by equity leaders.

28:20 – Coalition building inside and outside systems
 Working in solidarity with communities, students, and advocacy groups.

30:00 – Practitioner strategies for coalition building
 Affinity spaces, communities of practice, and collective leadership.

31:00 – Black women principals and community-led leadership
 Sustaining one another while advancing equity work on the ground.

33:00 – Moving in silence before going public
 Building trust and alignment before visibility.

34:00 – Listening tours and relational groundwork
 How equity offices formed strategy through deep listening rather than performative action.

35:00 – Precarity as a defining condition of equity leadership
 Why both relationships and structures are necessary for sustainability.

36:20 – Learning from “unsuccessful” leadership efforts
 How early efforts create future possibilities even when results aren’t immediate.

38:00 – Creating possibilities rather than guaranteed outcomes
 Why justice work cannot be measured only by short-term success.

39:10 – Challenges and opportunities of midday work
 Visibility, institutional pressure, and premature judgments of failure.

40:40 – Building organizational capacity during scrutiny
 Embedding equity into routines, data practices, and shared leadership.

42:30 – Preventing erasure of equity work
 Why documentation and storytelling matter in moments of backlash.

44:10 – Final reflections: key messages for equity leaders
 “Find your people,” stay in relationship, and keep doing the work.

46:00 – A new morning will come
 Why equity leadership practices cannot be erased, even when policies are rolled back.

48:40 – Practitioner workshops and closing
 Opportunities to engage with the book through Teachers College Press.

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